As the light from the torches gleans from a million pitchfork tines after Rick Santelli’s bizarre, gasket-blowing performance on CNBC yesterday, the Los Angeles Times finds an excellent story illustrating how the homeowner bailout is dividing otherwise like-minded Americans.
The LAT’s William Heisel finds two people who live on the same street in Long Beach, California, and are both underwater on their homes. One supports the bailout in part because it may help her stay in her house. The other opposes it. It’s a well-done exploration of both sides of the issue.
But what I really want to point out is how mortgage fraud rears its ugly head even in this story, where the homeowner isn’t exactly walking away from her note . That’s not surprising—it was an epidemic, but it’s one that many just don’t want to see.
Halloran blames herself for spending money she did not have, but she also says her mortgage broker and the bank that gave her the loan — the now failed Downey Savings & Loan in Newport Beach — promised lower payments. The loan documents she signed show an initial payment of $2,900 a month. Her first bill was for $4,200 a month.
That’s fraud point-blank. And this is a woman with a good job, hardly a subprime borrower. Imagine the wreckage unleashed by banks and brokers on actual subprime borrowers, who are much less wealthy and less educated. Don’t believe me? What about George W. Bush’s FBI? Here’s a story from nearly two years ago. And here’s the Seattle P-I’s good effort last month on mortgage fraud.
We know that some half of all subprime borrowers actually qualified for prime mortgages, with better terms, lower interest rates and lower payments, but were fraudulently put into more expensive ones by brokers who were incentivized with bonuses by the Countrywides of the world. But the vast majority of people, and I’ll bet you just about every last one of the commenters on my Santelli post yesterday, don’t know that.
Here’s the late Tanta, writing at Calculated Risk in May 2007, about why that is:
If you’re a reporter or editor who uses “ration” instead of “ratio” and “appraisal value” instead of “appraised value,” it is possible you haven’t had enough exposure to the industry and its lingo to know when smoke is being blown in your direction. And if I say you have no one to blame but yourself for printing nonsense from an industry shill, you better not start trying to explain to me why people who read CNNMoney are at fault if they don’t know more about their mortgage eligibility than their lender appears to. You are a reporter. You could have called Fannie and Freddie and asked them on what basis they have made these estimates. You could have asked Mr. Hardester about the exact nature of the “file review” he performed. You could have identified Guaranteed Rate as a mortgage banker who buys loans from brokers, not as a broker itself. You could have had a V-8.
What you did, though, is give us another “he said/she said” piece of tripe.
Here’s Gretchen Morgenson of The New York Times on why people were put into bad mortgages on purpose (she’s talking about Countrywide here):
The company’s incentive system also encouraged brokers and sales representatives to move borrowers into the subprime category, even if their financial position meant that they belonged higher up the loan spectrum. Brokers who peddled subprime loans received commissions of 0.50 percent of the loan’s value, versus 0.20 percent on loans one step up the quality ladder, known as Alternate-A, former brokers said. For years, a software system in Countrywide’s subprime unit that sales representatives used to calculate the loan type that a borrower qualified for did not allow the input of a borrower’s cash reserves, a former employee said.
A borrower who has more assets poses less risk to a lender, and will typically get a better rate on a loan as a result. But, this sales representative said, Countrywide’s software prevented the input of cash reserves so borrowers would have to be pitched on pricier loans.

I think you've completely missed the point here, Ryan. The anger is directed at the government bailout, not the individual homeowners. You're one of about 11 people in this country who didn't appreciate Mr. Santelli's rant. You also do a great job of linking to individual stories of emotion about fraud and home losses, but I would love to see you link some of these bold statements like: "We know that some half of all subprime borrowers actually qualified for prime mortgages, with better terms, lower interest rates and lower payments, but were fraudulently put into more expensive ones by brokers who were incentivized with bonuses by the Countrywides of the world." Are you honestly claiming that a full HALF of ALL subprime borrowers are victims of fraud? Is that your personal definition of fraud, or a legal definition? I also found it irresponsible of you to claim Ms. Halloran in the LA Times story was a victim of fraud, "point-blank". Did you interview her? Review her loan documents? There is no possible way you know if she was defrauded based on one quote in a newspaper article. While interesting, your article is completely off the mark in claiming people are angry at homeowners rather than at the government bailout using their tax dollars.
#1 Posted by Jeremy, CJR on Fri 20 Feb 2009 at 07:09 PM
Mr. Santelli is taking hypocrisy to new heights.
Did he rant and rave when "hardworking people" subsidized wall street? Where were his theatrics when AIG or BoA got bailed out?
Now Santelli is whining about the comments Gibbs made about his during a White House press conference and calling it "intimidation." Awww, poor Mr. Santelli. How brave of him to stick up for the poor, defenseless rich. Hypocrisy, sheer hypocrisy, trying to portray himself as a "victim." It just makes me sick.
For how long has wall street privatized profit and yet socialized their mistakes, calling the latter "externalities?" Enough! Mr. Santelli, why don't we call the homeowner’s bailout an "externality?" Turnabout is fair play!
You've had your way for the past 8 years Santelli, now your ship has come in. Deal with it.
#2 Posted by Jennifer, CJR on Fri 20 Feb 2009 at 07:50 PM
Hi, Jeremy,
It sure sounded like anger at individual homeowners to me when Santelli called them "losers." Go read the comments in my original post if you don't think there's a lot of anger at individual homeowners. My larger point is that this outrage is a headfake that scapegoats homeowners instead of the real culprits—you know, the ones on Wall Street who made tens millions of dollars creating this crisis and the mortgage brokers, many of whom made hundreds of thousands of dollars putting people into bad loans.
As far as "half of subprime borrowers were victims of fraud" thing, yes that's exactly what I'm claiming. The source for that information was Fannie Mae and it is in the Tanta post. I should've linked it in that paragraph, and I'll update the post to do that. But thanks for making my larger point that people don't know this stuff because the press has failed to report it fully.
And yes I'm claiming that that is fraudulent activity by the brokers and lenders. See here for an explanation of brokers' fiduciary responsibilities to their borrowers.
Finally, I haven't interviewed Ms. Halloran. But I trust that the Los Angeles Times reporter checked her documents out before printing her assertion. That's reporting 101. Maybe as a press critic I should be more skeptical, but I'll give them the benefit of the doubt on this one.
#3 Posted by Ryan Chittum, CJR on Fri 20 Feb 2009 at 07:57 PM
I suggest the author of this post get educated about the grassroots anger in America fast:
http://amfreenet.com/2009/02/chicago-tea-party/
http://wizbangblog.com/content/2009/02/20/get-ready-to-party.php
There are tea-parties and tax protests springing up spontaneously -- not funded nor organized by any political front groups. The press was suppose to be the sacred defender of American Freedoms by calling the leadership on its failings. Obama and his team are punishing achievers and rewarding non-achievers, and the hard working people of this country are beginning to revolt -- they don't want their tax dollars squandered and useless projects that cater to special interest groups. The elite press is totally failing in its duties, and the shame is all yours.
http://theanchoressonline.com/2009/02/20/scrubbing-the-news-for-obama/
#4 Posted by Mutnodjmet, CJR on Fri 20 Feb 2009 at 09:52 PM
Jennifer,
Rick Santelli is a regular on CNBC and had been having similar "rants" about government welfare / bailouts for the last 2 years. He opposed the government's interference in AIG and the TARP money and all of it. Check it out, he's all over YouTube (many more videos than just the "rant" from the other day)... you might learn something!
What is sad is that you think anyone involved in finance and trading is responsible for this damn mess we're in. What is even more depressing is the lack of knowledge in this country of personal and business economics (hell, it's only your money, security, welfare, retirement).
The truth is that neither AIG nor my stupid cousin who bought a house 50% too expensive for her should be let off the hook.
#5 Posted by Scott, CJR on Fri 20 Feb 2009 at 11:34 PM
i sadly stumbled upon this strained deflection of the growing dissent of the american people to bailouts for dropouts (no, no - it as the greed - it was the greed!) and found your succinct rebuke, jeremy. thanks for that.
#6 Posted by nate, CJR on Sat 21 Feb 2009 at 12:19 AM
I am aware of one friend who put down $50,000 on a 220,000 mortgage. Now this woman is an educated and highly intelligent scientist. Her credit score at the time of the mortgage was 720. She went over the disclosure of mortgage information before the closing and had many comments back and forth with her broker on the mortgage. At closing she signed a the large stack of documents that most of of do at closing. Unfortunately one of those documents with her actual rate and the type of mortgage was changed but in the haste of the closing she initialed and signed her papers. She later found out she had been put in a ARM/Ballon. She kept up her payments even when the payments increased exponentially. The lender put a 3 year penalty period before she could refinance( Nice mortgage people). She later got sick and found out she had colon cancer. Now without her original income and additional medical bills. She went through her savings, to help pay the mortgage and college loans etc etc etc. The result was a foreclosure, and she passed away a few weeks ago homeless. I don't know where the compassion in this country went with some of the monstrous evil humans I see ranting and raving about helping so called losers. I know their is a special place in hell for these people . So they can leave my dear friend at peace. I was in Sweden a year ago , they are not in the financial dire straits we and other capitalist countries face. They care for their people and it is not a bad thing for the government to help. They are not losers they appear to be winners. I think we in this country have been the losers for far too long.
#7 Posted by SMGM, CJR on Sat 21 Feb 2009 at 11:24 AM
1. I'm very skeptical that 30-something people commented on your post on the 19th. It looks like you got spammed by one or two people.
2. I am having trouble reconciling the idea that borrowers that could qualify for Alt-A or prime were shoved into subprime with the idea that lenders were filling up subprime MBS with shit and selling it off to the greater fool.
3. I think that we should look at each issue separately. The fact that we gave money to banks doesn't change whether bailing out homeowners is a good idea.
#8 Posted by Chris Corliss, CJR on Sat 21 Feb 2009 at 11:25 AM
"What is sad is that you think anyone involved in finance and trading is responsible for this damn mess we're in."
--
Amen. The fact is, its loosers who cannot pay there bills who are at fault, and you can lie about the fact that we were forced to give lones to shiftless and lazy minorities, but that's why. CRA. Facts, liberals. Learn how to use them.
#9 Posted by Gary Ruppert, CJR on Sat 21 Feb 2009 at 02:40 PM
Hey, Chris,
1. I don't think somebody's taken the time to comment under a fake name every few minutes for two days, 156 times as of this minute. We got a lot of inbound links. But I can get a traffic check on that.
2. I don't follow you on that one. The great flood of money around the world was seeking every bit of incremental return it could get in a low-yield environment. They latched on to these "AAA"-rated mortgage securities. The subprime ones brought higher returns, so there was high demand for them. That trickled down from the securitizers (Wall Street) to the lenders (Countrywide, etc.) to the mortgage brokers, who got paid higher bonuses to put people in subprime mortgages with worse terms. How doesn't that make sense?
The fact is, mortgage brokerage is a seamy business in the best of times. In the bubble you had intense pressure for a certain kind of product (subprime), brokers that were PAID TO put people in worse mortgages than they deserved. I'm not defending the many Americans who knowingly bought too much house and cashed out "equity" from inflated appraisals with HELOCs and lived large, but I suspect those types are already long gone from their houses and won't benefit from the bailout. Good riddance, I say.
3. Fair point. I'm not sold on bailing out the housing market. From what I've seen of this plan, it looks okay as far as those things go. What gets me, though, is that homeowners getting billions (much of which, as I've said, will go to banks anyway) from Washington is somehow more outrageous with these folks than the finance industry getting trillions.
You read us a lot so you may have seen The Audit has long thought that the press hasn't done its job in fully explaining Wall Street's culpability in the creation of the crisis. Follow the money, as they say. The book "Chain of Blame" is a good place to start:
http://www.amazon.com/Chain-Blame-Street-Caused-Mortgage/dp/0470292776
And if you haven't listened or read the transcript of "The Giant Pool of Money" from This American Life, I really would encourage you to take an hour sometime. It's an excellent explanation of much of what I'm talking about.
#10 Posted by Ryan Chittum, CJR on Sat 21 Feb 2009 at 04:25 PM
Full disclosure: I am a ‘natural born’ US Citizen, classically educated in Economics and a 3rd generation, 30 year small business person. I self-describe my politics as ‘ConCon’, Constitutional Conservative. I have spent a good amount of time attempting to understand this financial crisis by looking at all sources of information available and have come to the conclusion that there are many to blame but there will be much work that must yet be done into the investigation of possibly unconstitutional and likely criminal involvement. The investigations should not be totally controlled by any culpable participants including the US Federal or State Governments and certainly not by the untrustworthy US Media. So who does that leave to conduct this needed investigation? May I suggest us, you, me and others! Regarding Mr. Santelli’s concerns, about which you seem to be attempting to disregard and deride, I am very disappointed in the way you have handled this subject and think that you are doing yourself, your profession and your country a disservice by not recognizing or attempting to denigrate the genuine rising tide of anger in this country. At least try to offer a fair interpretation.
I found your replies to the post to this article by ‘Jeremy’ and others as that of an ideologue. Shamefully you have taken sides instead of doing what a “Journalist” has sworn to do. Your documentation consists of fellow travelers, other newspaper accounts, a blog, a book written by journalist and an NPR radio program all of which studiously offer the same doctrinaire analyst of the root cause of the mortgage crisis.
May I suggest you, as the Professional Journalist, widen your net and try to find more reliable sources that may even have a different point of view on the genesis of the crisis? Other points of views are very easily found, so easy that even I can do so before sunrise on a Sunday morning! Here’s a tip, Google, The True Origins of This Financial Crisis, Peter J. Wallison or if that is too much trouble here is URL: http://www.aei.org/publications/filter.all,pubID.29372/pub_detail.asp .
I implore you to try to do a better job; I don’t want the CJR to end up like the TJR...The Journal Register, bankrupt in ideas and now just bankrupt! One way or another a free citizen will have a legitimate press that represents everyone.
Best regards, Not necessarily a fan
#11 Posted by Not neccessarily a fan, CJR on Sun 22 Feb 2009 at 07:09 AM
Lord help you, Ryan! The con-artists (con-con artists?) are nipping at your heels. Your piece is good, as is Starkman's reporting and the excellent work that Mike Hudson has been doing for, like, 20 years. Would that more people would read and understand this, but as so many here have posted, the "just can't believe" that people would do what they do every day.
I think it's a cultural issue. To oversimplify, the frat-jocks surrounding Santelli on that trading floor are of a piece with the frat-jocks who manned the boiler rooms and started all those shifty mortgage brokerages. They are steeped in an ideology--more than an ideology, really; a lifestyle--that reveres the clever, the macho and the myopic. These men (the vast majority of them are white men) have been trained since puberty to believe that they are an elite, and that, upon graduation from BU or Seton Hall (or just some bullshit Catholic high school) they are entitled to "earn" no less than $100,000 per year as salesmen. That is the minimum. Whether selling cars, advertising, stocks, mortgages or pork-belly futures, they will "work hard, play hard" and be a "success." Everyone else is a "loser."
One of the great strengths of the NPR "Giant Pool of Money" piece was in meeting some of these ex bartenders and hearing about their actual lifestyles. Here in Baltimore, the bartenders flooded out of places like the Bay Cafe and transformed vast swaths of the city, rebuilding it in their own image.
These men are pure America. They're suburban, they fear and loath black people, and they buy giant luxury trucks and 40-foot Rinker yachts to signal their wealth and power. They are angry now as ever, shifting their business model into "foreclosure rescue" scams, complaining about taxes, betting on football and snorting coke, sneering at the "losers." They are the fragile blackshirts of the crisis's next stage.
#12 Posted by ed ericson, CJR on Sun 22 Feb 2009 at 11:19 AM
Ryan
I certainly appreciate you calling out the corruption that was taking place during the mortgage bubble. Anytime an economic bubble exists, there will be corruption. Take a look at the last bubble...the tech bubble of the late 90's. The corruption of Wall St. brokerages in manipulating the individual investor and using illegal selling software in causing the crash (similar to the naked short-selling that has helped fuel the current freefall). When the government comes out and disallows short-selling on certain securities, there should be a HUGE red flag to indivisual investors as to how the laws are rigged against them. Anyway, the last bubble definitely created lending corruption. During the last bubble, I was telling people that Wall Street's corruption would cause economic problems sooner or later. The sharks would devour all the individuals and then turn on each other until only a few remained. The result...a big economic disaster. I said then, I would be happy to see their demise. Now, just a few short years later, it has played out; not the way I had envisioned, but nonetheless it has happened. I was sickened when we bailed out Wall Street. Nobody was there to bail me out during the tech crash??? Now I will pay taxes to bail out Wall Street...how ironic! As far as home buyers are concerned, there are many less educated buyers that were eager to get a home and probably had a broker lie on an application and get their mortgage closed and put them in a house they couldn't afford (the same thing happens with autos and electronics, etc.). Unfortunately, the reality is the home will be foreclosed. I agree they should be allowed to own a home...just not one they can't afford! I can't believe the posts I have read about intelligent people being duped by a mortgage broker. The details of the mortgage (rate, term, etc.) are disclosed by federal law in elementary grade language. Most people did not get duped, they were so excited about being able to sign for a better home than they ever dreamed of getting (for a reason) that they signed on the line. THEY KNEW THE TERMS OF THE MORTGAGE! If your are saying that some of those people were to stupid to figure that they couldn't afford the payment when the mortgage interest rate reset, then I say hogwash. I bought a home in the last few years and I could have had a really low variable rate, but instead got a very good fixed rate and bought a home I new I could afford...not in the area I would really love to live in, but in a decent area I could afford...interesting concept! Now you want me to pay more taxes to help the person who made an unintelligent emotional decision??? I am a middle class American. I am the majority. I have been preparing for upcoming economic hardship (I am in the minority there). Now that the hardship is here, I am bailing out Wall Street and the ill-advised emotional purchases made by people that knew what they were doing. I agree that a percentage of home purchases were aided by mortgage broker fraud...no doubt. That is what happens to less educated buyers sometimes. I don't agree with it and I don't condone it. However, I should NOT have to pay for it! I should be paying taxes to law enforcement who will put those crooks in jail.
As you can see...I am not for any bailouts. I am for helping some of the less educated and less fortunate get a house they can afford. The truth is that most people in foreclosure made emotional, bad decisions and now have to answer for those decisions. You are trying to rally public sentiment against the banking industry. I think that is a little irresponsible. I know your job is to sell advertising and I do appreciate how you operate. A very provocative column you have produced.
David
#13 Posted by David, CJR on Sun 22 Feb 2009 at 01:39 PM
Santelli is voicing what most Americans feel.
Fact is, Fannie and Freddie were warned numerous times by regulators. Regulators were called racists and blown off by Barney Frank, Maxine Waters and Co. in 2003-2005.
That's why the U.S. and world economy is in shambles. NOT because of the "failed policies of the last 8 years" implying George W. Bush is the culprit.
So now, for Obama to "fix" the problem caused by Freddie and Fannie with $200B to Freddie and Fannie is simply insulting.
Anyone out there ever read the 10th Amendment to the Constitution, one of the Bill of Rights?
Look it up.
THOMAS JEFFERSON - CHANGE WE CAN BELIEVE IN.
#14 Posted by Rich M, CJR on Sun 22 Feb 2009 at 03:40 PM
Fannie and Freedie don't originate loans
According to a study by the Federal Reserve, 94% of high-cost loans originated during the housing boom had nothing to do with Community Reinvestment Act goals. Lending to poor didn't spur crisis -Fed's Kroszner
The Comptroller of the Currency. John C. Dugan, agrees: "CRA [the Community Reinvestment Act] is not the culprit behind the subprime mortgage lending abuses, or the broader credit quality issues in the marketplace. Indeed, the lenders most prominently associated with subprime mortgage lending abuses and high rates of foreclosure are lenders not subject to CRA.
A recent study of 2006 Home Mortgage Disclosure Act data showed that banks subject to CRA and their affiliates originated or purchased only six percent of the reported high cost loans made to lower-income borrowers within their CRA assessment areas."**
* Remarks by John C. Dugan, Comptroller of the Currency, before the Enterprise Annual Network Conference (November 19, 2008), available at www.occ.gov/ftp/release/2008-136a.pdf.
** Glenn B. Canner, Senior Advisor, Federal Reserve Board, "2007 HMDA Data: Identifying Trends and Potential Regulatory Concerns," presentation at the Consumer Bankers Association's 2008 CRA and Fair Lending Colloquium, October 27, 2008.
http://www.responsiblelending.org/issues/mortgage/quick-references/cra-is-not-to-blame-for-blame-for-the-mortgage-meltdown.html
#15 Posted by Burghman, CJR on Sun 22 Feb 2009 at 04:48 PM
Kudos to the author!!! The FBI labeled the real estate industry "Organized Crime" long ago. The mortgage industry is pure fraud from top to bottom and the industry is desperately trying to perpetuate the myth that the hapless victims are to blame.
I was an appraiser, I was there, I saw it. Nothing but bait and switch, blatant fraud and a public duped by an industry utterly devoid of ethics.
Read Matthew Bomchill's declaration, or Christopher Warren's confession. See mortgagefraudblog.com, MSFraud.org or just type "Mortgage fraud" in your browser.
#16 Posted by Stephen, CJR on Mon 23 Feb 2009 at 09:49 AM
Santelli's rant was scripted and planned. It was a total fraud. He was railing against people who are in trouble because of abuse by lenders who have been deceptive. Why rail against people who are trying to keep their mortgages paid. He hadn't even read the plan yet. He admitted it later when he was interviewed.
Here is the twitter that was sent where it showed it was planned.
the Santelli rant was totally scripted Meryl and the reaction on Internet press and twitter exactly what CNBC wanted. Cramer 2
Cramer2....guess who... Jim Cramer...what do you think... involved to his eyebrows...
#17 Posted by Annette, Missouri, CJR on Mon 23 Feb 2009 at 06:51 PM
1. On the spamming issue, as you point out, I read you guys a lot (and really enjoy it). Even on your more caustic posts, I rarely see more than 5 to 10 comments. 156 would be one hell of a fat tail. The writing on the comments also seems pretty similar. I don't know... maybe it was a College Republicans group somewhere or something.
2. Yeah I think I worded that point too broadly. Let me revise it to only talking about this story in particular. If they were putting Alt-A borrowers in sub prime, that would by definition improve the quality of those securities (since the buyers of the MBS were told that they were getting sub prime borrowers). I have also read that some prime borrowers took out subprime loans because it allowed them to borrow much more.
3. Yeah Elinore recommended "The Giant Pool of Money" too. I'll check it out
#18 Posted by Chris Corliss, CJR on Mon 23 Feb 2009 at 07:37 PM
I think that the rant came out and maybe sounded harsh , but in the end it was a message to the administration. I had to shortsell my house years ago, because of alot of circumstances. I didn't want to but I had some tough breaks. I rented for years and saved money and now have a house. Not all situations are the same, and we do have compassion but we are not stupid either. I think alot of this anger or frustration is because this bail out and supposed stimulus was rammed down our throats and the congress is behaving like greedy, stupid ......They didn't even read the bill. I read about louisiana's governor saying he is not going to except the monies, and frankly I agree with him. We made a terrible mistake when we voted in this congress. Unfortunately, clinton took away the regulations and Bush left it like that. They are all to blame
#19 Posted by maria, CJR on Mon 23 Feb 2009 at 08:40 PM
Moral failure. Why else regulate but for that? Everyone, from the top down, failed. But the top is worse because they hold the power, the money, and the gates open for everyone else to step through. Where's the remorse?
#20 Posted by Susan C, CJR on Mon 23 Feb 2009 at 09:03 PM
Excellent job, Ryan! It's astonishing to see how easily the minds of the people can be manipulated to blame the victims--rather than the real culprits! This twisted, misplaced outrage is pathetic. Taxpayer money [socialism] to help fellow Americans--unthinkable!! Taxpayer trillions [socialism] for wars, WallStreet,and Israel--priceless!! It's the neo-Ameri-con Way!!
#21 Posted by Ms. R., CJR on Tue 24 Feb 2009 at 12:51 AM
I agree with the words of Christ. "It is easier for a camel to get through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to get into Heaven". Not that Christ despised rich people, but He knew, rich people were going to put money before neighbor, country, friend etc. Their 'self-preservation' attitude would eventually become cannibalistic, and lead to the downfall of society as a whole. The very thing they (the wealthy) fear will come upon them, and the hell they create for others will become their own. Rick Santelli and the wall street crowd are afraid. They are scared that the same misfortune that is engulfing their neighbors, is about to drown them. Yes, it was people biting off more they could chew with mortgages, but it was greedy, powerful, rich money changers who wrapped that false hope up in worthless derivatives, and credit default swaps, and sold them to other greedy money lenders. Now its time to reap what has been sown. Religious or nonreligious, Christ's words ring true once again.
#22 Posted by RobertOrr, CJR on Tue 24 Feb 2009 at 12:58 PM
Since you were so harsh about fact checking, Jeremy, how about pointing those fingers back at yourself. Wheres your scientific proof for "You're one of about 11 people in this country who didn't appreciate Mr. Santelli's rant." ? que pasa punto?
#23 Posted by chad, CJR on Tue 24 Feb 2009 at 09:07 PM
I don't buy this "Wallstreet's the only culprit" argument being passed around to excuse the socialist policies now taking place, and to defame Santelli. It's overly simplistic and utterly ignorant of the factors that got us into this mess. The truth is that both lendees and lenders have been at fault here. "Predatory Lending" is just a way of excusing the lendee from not reading the fine print and not going for alternative yet simpler loan.
If anyone asks what made such ridiculous lending policies possible, look at the Federal Reserve. It bails out institutions that have made stupid bets while diluting the value of the dollar. Where's the incentive for major banks to make lend out safe loans? That's not free market economics; that's theft of my savings and yours.
#24 Posted by David, CJR on Tue 24 Feb 2009 at 11:06 PM
You had a situation where people who wouldve qualified for prime mortgage loan but had to compete to buy a home in market thats was down right crazy, house prices where rising faster than salaries in America. People where willing to do whatver it took to get in a home that was acceptable even if it meant overextending.
I dont take it personal that banks made their money off of me, but I do take it personal when they failed to captialize on the money they made from my mortgage and now they get an interest free loan from our tax dollars.
#25 Posted by MR. GIBBS, CJR on Wed 25 Feb 2009 at 06:57 AM
It’s going to be impossible to figure out which distressed homeowners were duped, dumb, or avaricious, and treat each category accordingly. It’s going to be impossible to weed out the shady mortgage brokers, and the white-shoe firm hotshots who bundled together a bunch of toxic waste and sold them as bouquets of roses. And what exactly do you do with the greedy idiots who bought the stuff? Recapitalize them with your money, and with mine?
Yet our tax dollars are going to be used in ways even the best and the brightest can’t figure out, let along articulate. Geithner was one high IQ joke in his address to the nation. Not Mensa’s finest hour.
I think the shoe’s on the other foot this year. There’s probably a statute or two on the federal, state, and local books that makes it illegal for me to call for a moratorium on tax payments until the government gets its act together, so I won’t do that.
That said, it would certainly be righteous for the citizens of this nation to demand that our government fully explain, in terms that are clear to PhD’s in economics and Wal-Mart cashiers alike (and given the rash of layoffs, there may be some individuals who are both), exactly how the government plans to use our money this year.
Read more at http://www.loosekannon.com.
#26 Posted by LooseKannon, CJR on Wed 25 Feb 2009 at 06:10 PM
Instead of protesting the Government for trying to get us all out of the bad decision making process that corporate America has created. How about supporting our government for at least trying?
Tea Party of 1773 is in no-way a comparison to the devastation that families across America have had to endure.
Instead of protesting Washington’s intended help for the bad economic situation ,,how about protesting the highly inflated C.E.O salaries that made bad judgments of investing that caused the economy to spiral downward at a rapid pace . Most of these C.E.O’s have step down and have retired very rich with a more than healthy lifestyle.
Comparing this to the Tea Party of 1773 is without question – observe!
Will we have to pay for this, for generation to come? Of course!
Is it to be blamed on home owners that have lost their jobs due to bad decision making of corporate America? Absolutely Not!!!
#27 Posted by Shane Mac, CJR on Sat 28 Feb 2009 at 06:37 PM
Check out this story from "The Exiled," by Mark Ames and Sasha Levine. It's either a hoax (doesn't sound like one) or the best scoop on the real Rick Santelli story.
http://exiledonline.com/exposing-the-familiar-rightwing-pr-machine-is-cnbcs-rick-santelli-
sucking-koch/
They allege it was all part of an arranged right-wing effort, with fake "grass roots" groups starting "tea parties" as Santelli suggested in his notorious CNBC rant, and "stories" planted all over the place.
Next is an account of Levine's attendance at one of the fake "rallies."
http://exiledonline.com/astroturf-revolution-dispatch-koch-activists-teabag-media/
If what these guys say is true, the rest of the press totally missed the boat.
Somehow, I think what they say is genuine. Let's see what other readers think.
#28 Posted by Brad Berthold, CJR on Sat 28 Feb 2009 at 08:27 PM
Hey Jeremy, sounds lime he did look at her documents:
"The loan documents she signed show an initial payment of $2,900 a month. Her first bill was for $4,200 a month."
#29 Posted by Mark, CJR on Fri 6 Mar 2009 at 12:47 AM
Hey Jeremy, sounds like he did look at her documents:
"The loan documents she signed show an initial payment of $2,900 a month. Her first bill was for $4,200 a month."
#30 Posted by Mark, CJR on Fri 6 Mar 2009 at 12:48 AM
"Amen. The fact is, its loosers who cannot pay there bills who are at fault, and you can lie about the fact that we were forced to give lones to shiftless and lazy minorities, but that's why. CRA. Facts, liberals. Learn how to use them."
Gary, first off it's 'losers' not 'loosers' and 'loans' not 'lones'. Secondly you need to stop listening to that brain dead fascist Rush Limbaugh because the CRA and minorities had nothing to do with this mess. Their are plenty of resources out there to prove this. Start with hud.gov and go from there. Stop being an embarrassment to real Americans and do your own homework.
#31 Posted by Mark, CJR on Fri 6 Mar 2009 at 12:59 AM
"What is sad is that you think anyone involved in finance and trading is responsible for this damn mess we're in. What is even more depressing is the lack of knowledge in this country of personal and business economics (hell, it's only your money, security, welfare, retirement)."
Scott,
What I think is that you are blinded by the fact you and some of your buddies in finance screwed over so many people. And no one said that everyone in the financial industry caused this mess except you.
Oh, and I understand economics just fine. Should we talk about Keynesian economics, supply side economics (also called voodoo economics), shall we put a neo-liberal spin on it or an Austrian school spin on it.
The fact is, and it has been well documented in hearings and interviews, that the financial sector in this country went balls out for greed. Pure and simple. Unbridled Conservative gotcha greed.
#32 Posted by Mark, CJR on Fri 6 Mar 2009 at 01:13 AM
Hi,
I think the article give us a very good idea about to the mortgage fraud.I my point of view there is no any country in the world who save from the these worth events ,such like fraud.crimes and terrorism.It is the responsibility of the government that he should control the situation.
#33 Posted by Shopping Cart, CJR on Thu 2 Apr 2009 at 04:13 AM
Hi,
I think the article give us a very good idea about to the mortgage fraud.I my point of view there is no any country in the world who save from the these worth events ,such like fraud.crimes and terrorism.It is the responsibility of the government that he should control the situation.Shopping Cart.
#34 Posted by Shopping Cart, CJR on Thu 2 Apr 2009 at 04:20 AM
You highlilght some of the reasons for the economic downturn that has affected my quality solid carbide tools company.
#35 Posted by Jim, CJR on Thu 22 Sep 2011 at 03:09 PM