Last Monday, Der Spiegel editor Mathias Müller von Blumencron joined Bernhard Zand, the magazine’s Arabic-speaking middle east correspondent, in Baghdad. They’d scored a rare interview with Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki, which they planned on conducting together.
That same day, The New York Times ran an op-ed by Barack Obama reiterating his support for a sixteen-month timetable for the withdrawal of most U.S. troops from Iraq.
So on Tuesday, when the German journalists joined al-Maliki and a handful of aides for an interview pegged to the prime minister’s upcoming visit to their country, the op-ed was on people’s minds—even inside the locked-down Green Zone.
“It was very clear that [al-Maliki had] read it,” Müller von Blumencron told CJR. “It was kind of innocent how he came up with the sixteen-month thing. We didn’t ask him, he just brought it up.”
Innocent or not, the favorable mention of Obama’s plan drew their eye. ”We knew it could provoke some attention, but we had no idea how much attention,” says Müller von Blumencron.
It wasn’t until Saturday that Der Spiegel posted its interview with al-Maliki, which included this exchange:
SPIEGEL: Would you hazard a prediction as to when most of the US troops will finally leave Iraq?
Maliki: As soon as possible, as far as we’re concerned. U.S. presidential candidate Barack Obama talks about 16 months. That, we think, would be the right timeframe for a withdrawal, with the possibility of slight changes.
And so were born the weekend’s headlines.
But things got complicated later on Saturday, when, after being contacted by American officials, Maliki spokesperson Ali al-Dabbagh (who was himself in the room for the Spiegel interview) issued a statement claiming that the prime minister’s statements to the magazine “have been misunderstood and mistranslated” without naming a specific mistranslation or misunderstanding.
And on Saturday and Sunday, while some news organizations, like CNN, reported the matter as a he-said-she-said, most outlets pointed out that the al-Dabbagh denial was remarkably vague and perfunctory. The discussion was haunted by the frustrating question of the statement’s accuracy; no one made a serious attempt to sort the truth out, to contact Der Spiegel to hear the tape for themselves, and to put the argument to rest.
Except the Times.
In a Monday story, the paper was first to report that the translator in the room had been Maliki’s, and giving its own self-described “direct” translation of the Obama quote.
“Obama’s remarks that — if he takes office — in 16 months he would withdraw the forces, we think that this period could increase or decrease a little, but that it could be suitable to end the presence of the forces in Iraq… Who wants to exit in a quicker way has a better assessment of the situation in Iraq.”
How come that version is so different from Der Spiegel’s version?
“His original words were unprintable. It would have been embarrassing to him. So we edited it,” says Müller von Blumencron. “There are very few people you can do a Q&A with without editing for grammar. And you always have to make it shorter.”
Quite true. As any journalist could tell you, if a printed interview transcript reads like a punchy exchange, with each sentence a complete thought and each paragraph well formed, odds are someone has done a lot of tweaking to help the direct transcription along. But extreme care must be taken not to distort the speaker’s original meaning.
The editor’s hand gives any claim of misrepresentation a little credence—especially if there’s translation involved too. During the interview, Der Spiegel spoke in English, and after listening to each question repeated in Arabic, and hearing Maliki’s responses in Arabic, finally heard its answer in English via Maliki’s translator. Through it all, Zand would have been able to monitor each step of the translation for any slip-ups.
Der Spiegel proudly stands by its work. (And rightly so—events have borne them out.) Their tape contains both Maliki’s original Arabic and the translator’s real-time English. When the magazine readied the transcript, Zand verified the translation against Maliki’s Arabic. On this sensitive interview, and the Obama portion of the interview, Müller von Blumencron emphasizes they stayed “very close. Very, very close.”
So how did the Times get its listen? Simple—it asked. According to Müller von Blumencron, Times reporter Sabrina Tavernise and her translator met with Zand in Baghdad, where he played them the relevant quote.
There’s something else that journalists calling Der Spiegel would have learned. “We have a policy at Der Spiegel when we do a question and answer session to provide a transcript to our counterparts in case they want to have a minor thing changed,” says Müller von Blumencron, who says Zand verified that Maliki’s aides received the publication-ready advance copy. They had no response, and presumably no complaints, before its release.
Der Spiegel has no plans to release the tape (“We don’t see a need to improve upon our credibility by, say, putting the audio on the web.”) but is happy to play it—in person, over the phone—for any journalist interested in verifying.
“Anyone who wants to hear it can hear it,” says Müller von Blumencron. “But no one else has asked.”





May I add that this is a general policy in Germany - they do much more Q&As and because usually these can´t be printed without being slightly edited, it is a standard procedure to have it authorized by the interview partner. This is pretty uncommon in the U.S., but everybody does it in Germany - of course you will always fight with your interview partner in case he wants to soften his stances and usually you will reach at least a compromise.
Posted by elmateo on Wed 23 Jul 2008 at 02:00 AM
Clint Hendler misses a crucial point: Der Speigel issued two versions of the same al-Maliki interview.
The original exchange published went as follows:
SPIEGEL: Would you hazard a prediction as to when most of the US troops will finally leave Iraq?
Maliki: As soon as possible, as far as we’re concerned. US presidential candidate Barack Obama is right when he talks about 16 months. Assuming that positive developments continue, this is about the same time period that corresponds to our wishes.
Subsequently Der Spiegel altered the exchange to read as thus:
SPIEGEL: Would you hazard a prediction as to when most of the US troops will finally leave Iraq?
Maliki: As soon as possible, as far as we’re concerned. U.S. presidential candidate Barack Obama talks about 16 months. That, we think, would be the right timeframe for a withdrawal, with the possibility of slight changes.
The qualifier "assuming that positive developments continue" was mysteriously deleted from the translation from no explanation. But the qualifier is key. With the qualifier, the 16 month timetable becomes conditions based. One has to ask: when al-Maliki was shown the translation of his remarks, a translation which he was said to have approved, which version was he shown?
Posted by DubiousD on Wed 23 Jul 2008 at 01:42 PM
Well, DubiousD, you´re missing a point: Der Spiegel is a German publication. They are being printed in German. And what they have on their English website are translations from the German only. So the only quote that matters is the one they printed in German and that one has always been the same! If they changed the quote on their English website, as you say, the only explanations is that the first translation from the German may have been inaccurate. But stop acting as if Spiegel was a magazine in English, it´s not, and the quote has always been the same in German, and it´s just identical to the one that´s on their English website now and it´s what the NYT has confirmed to be true. So I really don´t see your problem.
Posted by Pete C. on Wed 23 Jul 2008 at 06:58 PM
Pete C. wrote:
"So the only quote that matters is the one they printed in German and that one has always been the same!"
Pete, read Clint's piece right above you. He clearly states:
"During the interview, Der Spiegel spoke in English, and after listening to each question repeated in Arabic, and hearing Maliki’s responses in Arabic, finally heard its answer in English via Maliki’s translator."
Therefore the original transcript of Maliki's interview was in English, not German. Therefore the English transcript is the one that matters.
Additionally, if Der Spiegel is so confident that they transcribed Maliki's interview accurately, let them post audio from the interview on their web site so that we may be the judge.
Posted by DubiousD on Thu 24 Jul 2008 at 02:33 AM