A couple of times in the last few months I’ve taken the press to task for ignoring the Congressional Oversight Panel and its report on the TARP. I’ve talked to reporters in the biz since and got the impression that many of them don’t really take it seriously because its chairwoman Elizabeth Warren is a liberal who, they say, pushes her agenda.
So it’s worth listening to this entire Planet Money podcast from NPR, where Adam Davidson badgers Warren for more than an hour to justify her existence, so to speak.
If you want a peek inside business-press mentality, and why certain stories get reported and others don’t, you can do worse than start here. It sees Warren as an outlier whose views, based on decades of research, are suspicious. It would never, ever have badgered a former bank exec, say, like this if one had been chairman of the panel. Davidson, like the reporters I referenced above, has been talking to too many bankers and insiders who sneer at someone not inside their bubble. Perhaps he’s trying to prove his objective journalist bona fides at “liberal” NPR by taking it to a liberal.
Warren isn’t legitimate in the eyes of the press, so it just pretty much ignores her—even though she and her co-panelists were selected by Congress to oversee whether the Treasury is spending the $700 billion we gave it in a way that’s best for the economy.
This interview is really cringeworthy stuff from Davidson, who comes out looking pretty bad (which makes it all the more admirable that NPR runs the entire tape). Warren takes this fight going away.
I don’t have a complete transcript of the show but I typed up some of it.
Davidson signals early in the interview that this is going to be a contentious one:
I feel like I have a love affair/hate affair with the Congressional Oversight Panel.
And tells Warren that he’s frustrated at the makeup of the panel and especially Warren because “you have a point of view.” What’s that “point of view”? That Warren takes the side of the middle and working classes over the bankers. Heaven forfend!
To which Warren says:
So i gotta tell you, I just think you’re wrong. I’m somebody who believes in free markets. The American middle class is under assault…basically since the 70’s.
I’m not an advocate. i don’t get paid for anything. I’m an empiricist. I’m data driven.
And Warren schools Davidson on the difference between someone like her and someone like a lobbyist, who spins without concern about whether they’re wrong. She has to live with the record of what she says, while the lobbyist’s reputation is relatively untarnished by ignoring the truth because everyone expects him to lie.
But Davidson can’t get past the attempt to get her to delegitimize herself, as if the press hasn’t already done that for her:
Davidson: “I think you’re well known… as someone whose work points to a conclusion that banks and credit-card companies are giving a raw deal to consumers—I think it would not be terribly hard to find people who would agree with you—that your work is in opposition to the banks.
Warren: If you don’t have somebody who cares about American families, then they don’t have a seat at the table in this debate. i think this point is really important. We have a little tight insider world who understand exactly what synthetic derivatives are. My job in this world is to make sure that when these enormous profound decisions are being made, that the American family is there. That they are part of that process…because the decisions that are made will be different.
Booyah!
The blog Corrente has a transcript of a later part of the interview, and it’s worth quoting in full:
ADAM DAVIDSON: What it feels to me is what you are missing is that — I think we put aside your pet issues. We put them aside. We put them aside until this crisis is over.
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Adam Davidson essentially admits his own insider-oriented, in-the-bubble reporting style. His comments reflect not so much on Elizabeth Warren but on the breadth and depth of his own Rolodex. He seems to be talking to corporate execs and economists rather than doing much knocking on doors in struggling neighborhoods, talking to local community leaders or even reading the work of the many experts who've been digging into the growing burdens of household debt: "you are the only person I’ve talked to in a year of covering this crisis who has a view that we have two equally acute crises: a financial crisis and a household debt crisis that is equally acute in the same kind of way. I literally don’t know who else I can talk to support that view. I literally don’t know anyone other than you who has that view, and you are the person [snicker] who went to Congress to oversee it and you are presenting a very, very narrow view to the American people."
there are plenty of people out there who hold this view -- both average folks as well as scholars and researchers and smart thinkers.
Do some reporting Adam. Here's one place to start: http://www.demos.org/
#1 Posted by mwh, CJR on Thu 14 May 2009 at 04:08 PM
I blogged about this when it first hit. It's too bad, because normally I think the Planet Money podcast is great, but this really struck me as exactly what's wrong with journalism in general and the business press in particular. Note that Davidson assumes that believing in free markets is somehow a neutral position.
I also wrote about the sexism here, because in addition to not talking to an establishment voice the way he did, I kind of wonder whether he'd even have talked to an outlying male voice the way he did.
#2 Posted by Sarah J, CJR on Thu 14 May 2009 at 04:30 PM
I listened to this interview twice. I can hardly fathom what kind of nerd that makes me, but there was something so surreal about Adam Davidson and what he was doing and his whole thought process. It struck me as the epitome of the rot that exists within out media: a supposedly liberal news outlet, accusing probably the least biased person possible of bias because her views don't fall with the arbitrary "Serious" (aka invariably wrong and outdated) spectrum of views, and a journalist advocating that our government act in secret and contrary to the will of the public (aka the opposite of journalism).
Incidentally, I also want to marry Elizabeth Warren now.
#3 Posted by LorenzoStDuBois, CJR on Thu 14 May 2009 at 04:43 PM
I wonder how much more credibility Ms. Warren's view points would be getting if she were male. I think at least in part that's where this lack of respect and assumption that she's a lightweight is coming from.
#4 Posted by Judith, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 12:39 AM
NPR hasn't been the same since Gingrich & Friends yanked the bulk of their federal funding. Since they have to go hat in hand to so many corporations, they walk on tiptoe through the corporate landscape.
But even in that light, Adam Davidson is nothing but a lazy, smug reporter who wouldn't dream of attacking the same Wall Streeters he drinks with.
#5 Posted by Susie from Philly, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 10:23 AM
At best Adam Davidson is a supply sider who wants to pretend that he isn't. At worst Adam Davidson is an insider who wants to keep the bankes on his side.
#6 Posted by Gorge Only, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 01:42 PM
As I've said elsewhere:
The (male) host interrupting and demeaning the (female) guest is an old, old story. And not a pleasant one!
#7 Posted by lambert strether, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 01:54 PM
Williamson could benefit from working for C-SPAN where the byword is, "If you care who wins, you're in the wrong place."
#8 Posted by oldfuzz, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 03:00 PM
I watch and carefully listen to Elizabeth Warren every chance I get. She explains it like no one else and is smart as all get out. She hit the nail on the head when she replied to the clueless Davidson, "what you're saying makes no sense".
#9 Posted by Shaz, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 03:02 PM
You know, I think Davidson is right that Elizabeth Warren is not neutral in her approach to this issue. The question is, should she be? Neutral with respect to what or whom? If we assume that her job is to make sure the TARP funds are being spent in a way that is good for the economy, then we must have some assumptions about what economic characteristics are to be called good. GDP growth? Income growth? Lower unemployment? Less inflation? Less deflation? Lower debt? Which of these is more important? I'm not sure it's possible to be "neutral" on this if you actually know something about it.
Furthermore, and I wish more reporters understood this, it's far more interesting to ask whether someone is right than whether she's biased. Rather than attack her for merely having an opinion, Davidson should have asked her whether she was sure we could afford to protect American families from usurious credit card rates. How can she be sure it won't kill the banks and cause another credit crunch? Isn't the rationale for the whole TARP program to save the financial system, lest it take everyone else down with it? These are interesting, challenging questions that I suspect Davidson wanted to ask, but being afraid of seeming non-neutral himself, he never actually got down to them.
I should add that I'm not neutral on Elizabeth Warren—whether she's right or wrong on this issue, I want her for President.
#10 Posted by D. B., CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 03:15 PM
This is a wonderful review; thank you for getting this out there. I agree that if this "reporter," (snicker) has not found anyone other than Dr. Warren who has come to the fact-based conclusion that we have been on a ruinous path to a 2-class society (otherwise known as "Banana Republic"), then he is probably the laziest reporter in the universe! Obviously he does not know who Professor Larry Bartels (Princeton) is; or Dr. Dean Baker (Center for Economic Policy & Research); or Dr. Joseph Stiglitz...The data are out there, have been for years, and I can tell you that academics like me are reading what THEY have to say, and ignoring the mainstream (ie., Establishment) "media," altogether due to the blatant corporate bias. That this lazy reporter claims that Dr. Warren is "biased," is truly hilarious, since he apparently never bothered to find out who the OTHER members of the Congressional Oversight are. Please, everyone look up Sununu, who just took a post in February on the board of governors of a subsidiary to Bank of New York Mellon -- a firm that, in addition to receiving bailout funds, has been hired by the Treasury Department to administer the program! Sununu, along with the regressive Republican Jeb Hensarling, are quite clearly in a position of major conflict of interest, and this is very apparent in that they typically refuse to sign the Oversight Committee reports, and add in these "dissents," into the record, because they do not care for the facts-based analysis that is so important for Dr. Warren. Please see these stories:http://www.house.gov/apps/list/speech/tx05_hensarling/morenews/dmn.shtml
By Dave Michaels
As Published in the Dallas Morning News December 16, 2008
With Views in Minority, Gramm Protege Jeb Hensarling Rising in House:
Last month, House GOP leaders gave him a perch to question how the money is spent, naming him their appointee to a five-member panel overseeing the Treasury Department's $700 billion bailout fund. Yet Mr. Hensarling has yet to dig into the panel's work, feuding instead over whether he'll get his own staff.
"I have not heard from him, other than receiving his press release denouncing me for going to Clark County, Nev., to talk with people about foreclosures," said Elizabeth Warren, a Harvard law professor who chairs the panel.
In 2004, Mr. Hensarling reported shares valued between $450,000 and $1 million in Green Mountain Energy Co., Michaels Stores and Maverick Capital – firms that were either controlled or founded by Wyly family members. He sold Michaels stock valued at between $100,000 and $250,000 in June 2006, according to congressional records.
After a stint running a software firm, Mr. Hensarling won his congressional seat in 2002. Like Phil Gramm, who chaired the Senate Banking Committee, he wound up dealing with banking issues.
As Mr. Gramm once blocked attempts to rein in predatory home loans, Mr. Hensarling has resisted efforts to curb some of the most criticized practices of credit card issuers, including arbitrarily raising interest rates on cardholders. Both men have said they are defending practices that allow credit to be available to more people.
Mr. Hensarling still insists that government policy – including a law that encourages banks to lend in lower-income communities – drove the subprime crisis by encouraging shoddy underwriting. A recent study by the Federal Reserve Bank refuted that view. He also blames Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, saying their outsized influence encouraged other investors to keep up by writing increasingly risky loans.
Now see this, from way back in February, 2004! :
http://www.freddiemac.com/news/archives/afford_housing/2004/ensucasa_dallas_021904.html
CONGRESSMAN HENSARLING JOINS FREDDIE MAC, LOCAL PARTNERS TO LAUNCH $15 MILLION HISPANIC HOMEOWNER
#11 Posted by Elizabeth, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 03:17 PM
warren is neutral, but the data isn't.
#12 Posted by dieselm, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 03:53 PM
It's evident at the beginning of the interview that Davidson has a preconceived notion about Elizabeth Warren based on her interest and research on working families, and he basically questions her qualifications for the Oversight panel based on this. He calls it "advocacy" and later condescendingly refers it "her pet issues." I find it interest that he is so upfront about his clear bias towards her and I got the impression that he thought she was out to bring down the banks, which she clearly isn't it. Also, what's so disturbing about this is that Davidson is incapable of seeing how the economic distress of workers and families is connected to the current crisis. He clearly states that he thinks the banking system is the primary problem without seeing that the workers who put money into system (by buying homes, investing, and general consumption) are the ones who support, who keep it afloat. Without that money working it's way through the economy, through the banking system you have nothing. Warren tried to explain that the problem is broader than that (which he kept calling "a narrow view," which is ridiculous) and he just couldn't get it. I don't see how anyone can take him seriously as an economic reporter after this. He just couldn't let go of his bias toward what he thought she stood for, and couldn't see that she was making valid points about what we need to do now.
#13 Posted by inthestil, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 04:18 PM
Exactly right, Elizabeth (posted two above me). It's simple supply and demand. The investment bankers had a demand that the mortgage brokers filled through predatory lending practices. The fact that the corporate media is too fearful of calling it as simple as it really is is staggering.
#14 Posted by whytee, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 05:01 PM
Great summary of Adam Davidson's lack of journalistic integrity. Provides more evidence of the role of NPR and Planet Money in proselytizing propaganda and preserving the status quo, even when it costs the majority dearly.
#15 Posted by HJ James, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 07:45 PM
Davidson is from Marketplace, whose ideological spectrum ranges from AEI to Cato. That's about 10% of US and 3% of the world. Go figure.
#16 Posted by <0<, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 07:58 PM
If you want to hear a good Elizabeth Warren interview, listen to one of her Terri Gross interviews on Fresh Air. Or her Charlie Rose interview. Or even her Jon Stewart interview. I have been listening to her and reading her work for years. (She posts at the blog creditslips.org, although not so much recently, as she has more important things to do) No one explains financial issues as well as she does. I was appalled at the Planet Money interview, because usually the show is pretty good, although it is always better on the days AD is not on it. He seems too much like the guy trying to prove he's the smartest guy in the room. His producers need to keep him on a very short leash. When they do, they get a good product, like the "Giant Pools of Money" or the "Bad Bank" episodes on This American Life, which were excellent.
#17 Posted by Jennifer, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 08:58 PM
Don't know why Davidson took his tack. Perhaps he had an irresistible impulse to make a jackass out of himself.
Remember that when FDR and him administration rescued American capitalism from its own blunders, they financial lords of 'whatever' were dragged kicking and screaming to safety--and they didn't stop kicking and screaming until they began to get their way again in the the 1980's. Of course that brought us to our current state of affairs. And many of the people Davidson hangs with are kicking and screaming, especially concerning people like Elizabeth Warren, a woman no less! (Imagine if Ferdinand Pecora had worn a dress!) So his voice takes the part of the 'kicking and screaming' crowd.
Re: Marketplace, they are simply not as far right as you make them out to be. They are named after the financial markets, so that's their point of view, but when they interview AEI types, or allow them to editorialize, the right wing types are savaged in the formus. Robert Reich is a regular commentator. Adam Posen and Paul Krugman appear from time to time. Not a right wing bastion.
#18 Posted by KFrtiz, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 09:10 PM
When I heard the interview, my feeling was that Adam was rude and aggressive, but not wrong. IMHO, his point was that her expertise and perspective (and agenda) drove her toward objectives that were beyond the scope of the oversight panel and she, as well as the Republican appointees, could be counted on for their knee-jerk analysis and non-credible conclusions.
#19 Posted by Chris Marino, CJR on Fri 15 May 2009 at 09:18 PM
Elizabeth Warren's analysis is knee-jerk and non-credible? Chris, you must talk to the same people and read the same corporate propaganda as does AD.
#20 Posted by EW Fan, CJR on Sat 16 May 2009 at 12:37 AM
HI Ryan
If you think the media isn't paying enough attention to the TARP, I encourage you to listen to Marketplace, a public radio program on business and the economy. We broadcast stories on the TARP almost every week.
You might be interested in the interview of Elizabeth Warren, conducted by Marketplace host Kai Ryssdal, at the end of January.
You can find it on our website. Here's the link.
http://marketplace.publicradio.org/display/web/2009/01/29/pm_oversight_q/
#21 Posted by Paddy Hirsch, CJR on Sat 16 May 2009 at 02:46 AM
I am not sure that NPR is digging into the immense amount of data on these various issues. Simon Johnson does a good job of evidential support for his viewpoints as does the Financial Times, especially Martin Wolfe. It seems like NPR lost their thread after the election.
#22 Posted by m.wertz, CJR on Sat 16 May 2009 at 12:19 PM
Davidson is a disgrace as a journalist. It is also disappointing that NPR would hire someone that clearly violated their mission statement and then aired this show. It's clear that Davidson started with an agenda to marginalize and humiliate Ms Warren.
He acted like a lobbyist. I'm curious as the whether Davidson spends too much time with his "mainstream" economist buddies or he was actually paid off in some way to do this bit of trash journalism. FYI Mr Davidson, your mainstream buddies had no clue this banking and real estate meltdown was coming and were shocked at the severity. The few economists who did see this coming were labeled as part of the "fringe minority" that proved to be more accurate than the mainstream experts. How do you explain that?
#23 Posted by Peter, CJR on Sat 16 May 2009 at 02:22 PM
Davidson seemed to be playing to a crowd he expected to be part of later in the evening. To be sure the highballs, backslapping and "dumb B" comments were flying.
What a schmuck.
#24 Posted by LW, CJR on Sun 17 May 2009 at 10:20 AM
Judith and Sarah J there are few people more boring than those who reduce every issue to their own pet peeve. Remain germane.
#25 Posted by Arthur Boyer, CJR on Mon 18 May 2009 at 01:46 AM
The problem has always been that you have business reporters who think they know economics just because they "report on" financial markets. If one does not even understand that the average American household is indeed in a debt crisis, a discussion cannot even begin. Its like saying that we cannot discuss global warming unless we agree on whether CO2 is a greenhouse gas.
#26 Posted by MichaelS, CJR on Mon 18 May 2009 at 05:33 PM
Ms. Warren was way to nice to Davidson, although he still made a fool of himself. Try get Dean Baker on the show, and he will tell him whatsup.
#27 Posted by TheZha, CJR on Tue 19 May 2009 at 03:27 PM
When he was on Meet the Press he pretty much blamed people who took out loans they couldn't pay as being the heart of the financial crisis, instead of all the products the banks were selling off of the bad loans.
#28 Posted by Scott, CJR on Wed 20 May 2009 at 11:05 AM
The divide between all large corporate executives, especially but not exclusively "Wall Street," and the rest of this country is much deeper and more permanent than the "bubble" Warren refers to. Just like the airlines, we now have three classes: economy (aka "the real economy"), business (consisting mainly of tech-savvy service providers like quants and people who will pretend to believe anything for money like marketers, lobbyists and many journalists) and first (the revolving pool of "exceptionally talented" individuals who eviscerated the American economy and nearly crippled the global economy during the Reagan era). For those fortunate enough to be born into the first class, there's really no consequence for bad decisions that cost millions of people billions of dollars. There may be penalties for out-and-out fraud, but they are unlikely to fit the crime. Michael Milken is an apt example: allowed to plead guilty to reporting violations in order to avoid going on trial for racketeering and securities fraud, he did some soft time and was allowed to keep most of the money he "earned." Similarly, the guys who presided over the self-destruction of America's auto industry are going to reap enormous fortunes for doing so. By continuing to allow these first-class crooks to avoid all personal responsibility for their actions, we create an enormous moral hazard.
#29 Posted by Christian Doering, CJR on Wed 20 May 2009 at 12:22 PM
As a working journalist, I honestly don't see a problem with Davidson's attitude. His job is to force Warren to make the best case for her proposed policy. Isn't the best way to do that to mount the strongest case against that policy?
Sometimes, the only way to get someone you're interviewing to cut through their BS is to call them on it. I've only listened to the edited 13-minute edit of their argument, but to my ear it was a healthy, intellectually vigorous debate about policy between two very well-informed people.
By the way, it seems hypocritical for CJR's Ryan Chittum to be accusing Warren of having unacceptable political beliefs while Chittum is himself reporting on Warren's exercise of those beliefs. (That's what Chittum is doing in this post, right?) Unless -- ah, yes -- immaculately conceived objectivity is a standard we apply only to *other* journalists.
#30 Posted by Michael Andersen, CJR on Wed 3 Jun 2009 at 04:05 PM
I'm sorry, in that last paragraph "Warren" -> "Davidson."
#31 Posted by Michael Andersen, CJR on Wed 3 Jun 2009 at 04:06 PM
Uhh, Michael, my point is that Warren's views (though you'd be hard-pressed to find regular Americans who disagree with them) are outside what's acceptable to the mainstream press.
Davidson's treatment of her, because of her views, is that phenomenon, expressed more forthrightly and pointedly than it normally is. Normally, she has been just ignored.
#32 Posted by Ryan Chittum, CJR on Wed 3 Jun 2009 at 05:07 PM
what i would really want to hear is the unedited, un-cleaned-up version of the broadcast. my gut tells me that it was extensive and made to make davidson, an over-bearing prick, sound good. i never trust what he has to say
#33 Posted by greg critser, CJR on Wed 3 Jun 2009 at 06:48 PM
Davidson obviously thinks very, very highly of himself yet is simultaneously horrifically fearful that his strong biases and oversimplified views will be exposed. It's hard to imagine any other reason for his vile, arrogant, condescending, anti-journalistic attacks on Warren, who is far more qualified than Davidson to opine on these topics. Despite all that, she was extraordinarily gracious to him. Why hasn't NPR fired hiim? Perhaps because NPR has retained its political biases of the last eight years.
#34 Posted by ACL, CJR on Wed 1 Jul 2009 at 02:49 AM
Here's a quotation from his "apology":
"I liked the idea of revealing myself in a less than flattering light. Planet Money tries to be transparent and I liked the transparency of that."
Transparency? How about how much he receives in speaking fees from the banks he covers? JP Morgan, WellsFargo, Goldman Sachs, etc.
I do believe him when he says that no one he talks to agrees with Warren.
#35 Posted by Davis, CJR on Thu 9 Aug 2012 at 04:12 PM